Pa & Ma, i pellegrini dall'Olanda
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AylysRaziel
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- Iscritto il: mar mag 01, 2007 3:34 pm
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Mariateresa
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Scusa ha chi hai scritto?AylysRaziel ha scritto:Gli ho scritto ancora...
ma purtroppo la cosa sta finendo male... uno è a terra... morrà?
chiedo un miracolo... posso pescare nel mazzo del destino un miracolo?
almeno 1 vi prego...
1 che ricordi la crudeltà dell'uomo e l'inno alla vita...
Che tristezza oggi.
Re: Riporto un post di MariaTeresa
Io sono un po' incasinato se riesci a fare anche una sintesi parziale (soprattutto dell'articolo che viene citato) poi la giro sul forum di Planet firmandola a nome di Mariateresa e tuo.
Grazie mille Carlo[/quote]
ok ci provo... se vuoi digli intanto che se vogliono vedere un sito naturale dove parlare di lasciar fare alla natura ha un senso, si guardino il nido (vuoto purtroppo) di Shenandoah all'interno di un parco naturale e su una falesia a picco sulla foresta... perfino il nostro farfa e' naturale pur avendo un parco naturale relativamente piccolo ... un nido artificiale su una torre di cemento contornato da aree rurali (non naturali quindi) non gode della stessa condizione di "naturale" il nido finlandese di cui parlavo prima era in mezzo alla foresta e la finlandia e' perlopiu' natuale (e' un paese molto piu' grande dell'olanda e la abitano in 4 gatti) ..... Natura e' foreste, savane, tundra ecc. piene di animali non campi arati e torri di cemento!!!
Grazie mille Carlo[/quote]
ok ci provo... se vuoi digli intanto che se vogliono vedere un sito naturale dove parlare di lasciar fare alla natura ha un senso, si guardino il nido (vuoto purtroppo) di Shenandoah all'interno di un parco naturale e su una falesia a picco sulla foresta... perfino il nostro farfa e' naturale pur avendo un parco naturale relativamente piccolo ... un nido artificiale su una torre di cemento contornato da aree rurali (non naturali quindi) non gode della stessa condizione di "naturale" il nido finlandese di cui parlavo prima era in mezzo alla foresta e la finlandia e' perlopiu' natuale (e' un paese molto piu' grande dell'olanda e la abitano in 4 gatti) ..... Natura e' foreste, savane, tundra ecc. piene di animali non campi arati e torri di cemento!!!
"Il gatto disse: non sono un amico e non sono un servitore. Sono il gatto che cammina da solo e desidero entrare nella tua tana." Rudyard Kipling
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Sonia
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meglio di no, ma ti rispondono poi gli admin...Mariateresa ha scritto:'sti olandesi mi fanno inc....are (non ho ancora capito se si possono dire le parolacce); non fanno altro che fare filmini, scattare foto... ANDATELI A SALVAREEEEEE!!!
Anch'io ho tanta rabbia dentro per tutta questa ipocrisia, e ho già avuto modo di dire e scrivere che la crudeltà in diretta non è giusta.
Farebbero meglio a oscurare la cam, se ritengono di lasciar morire i piccoli...
Non bisogna giudicare gli uomini dalle loro amicizie: Giuda frequentava persone irreprensibili! (E.M.Hemingway)
http://www.provediemozioni.it/index.php ... ale&id=234
http://www.provediemozioni.it/index.php ... ale&id=234
Re: Riporto un post di MariaTeresa
Su questo mi sa che preferiscono illudersi..Roxy ha scritto: ok ci provo... se vuoi digli intanto che se vogliono vedere un sito naturale dove parlare di lasciar fare alla natura ha un senso, si guardino il nido (vuoto purtroppo) di Shenandoah all'interno di un parco naturale e su una falesia a picco sulla foresta... perfino il nostro farfa e' naturale pur avendo un parco naturale relativamente piccolo ... un nido artificiale su una torre di cemento contornato da aree rurali (non naturali quindi) non gode della stessa condizione di "naturale" il nido finlandese di cui parlavo prima era in mezzo alla foresta e la finlandia e' perlopiu' natuale (e' un paese molto piu' grande dell'olanda e la abitano in 4 gatti) ..... Natura e' foreste, savane, tundra ecc. piene di animali non campi arati e torri di cemento!!!
ho già battuto su questo tasto , ma non c'è peggior sordo di chi non vuol sentire..
Ultima modifica di Karlito75 il ven mag 04, 2007 1:15 pm, modificato 1 volta in totale.
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AylysRaziel
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Giallorossadoc
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GrazieGiallorossadoc ha scritto:sono andata...nonostante i miei proprositi di nuovo in cam....sembrano cosi fermi li nell'angolo...non emettono neppure suoni...
se vi serve una traduzione francese...son qui..anche se non sono bravissima posso provarci
visto che molti scrivono dal Quebec e altri parlano francese se hai voglia di sintetizzare la lettera di MariaTeresa o aggiungere cose tue io poi le posto volentieri nel forum di Planet.
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Giallorossadoc
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AylysRaziel
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Giovanna
- Site Admin
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- Iscritto il: mar mar 06, 2007 8:16 pm
- città di residenza: Padova
- Località: Padova
Eli, sempre disponibile ad aiutare per il francese, ma in questi giorni non ho molto tempo, quindi se vuoi rivedo la traduzione. Comunque normalmente là sono bilingui. Adesso so che eiguoc (Canada) è una signora e l'ho invitata a venire nel ns forum.
- São aves cheias de abismo,
Como nos sonhos as há.
- Fernando Pessoa
Como nos sonhos as há.
- Fernando Pessoa
traduzione
As you Dutch criticize mainly our way to consider the nest of De Mortel and often say you work following the rules of “NATURE” we feel obliged to explain some points from our point of view.
We would like to remind you that all over Europe there are very few places were NATURE is really natural… From yr webcam you see an artificial nest in an artificial building and all around a wonderful view of farms.. while natural places are forest, thunder, desert, savana (if you want to see how a natural scrape for a nest looks like whatch at the website of Shenandoah Park)…Farms and their environment belong to the part of world modified by human beings properly.
Our part of Europe has a lot of industrial areas or urban areas and ground used for agricultural cultivation… just a small part of it is free .. (while in the USA and Canada they have wide natural parks, our are mainly small from the point of view of a falcon. This is why we control the number of several animal by banding them, this is why we try to protect and rescue animals wounded or in difficulty (in specialized rescue centers) there are projects for turtles, eagles, fogs and hundreds or thousands of other animals. Even if Netherlands is trying to do the best to reduce pollution and chemicals, the use of some of them (less dangerous we assume) is still allowed and necessary to farmers to avoid attacks of parasites… but parasites are often the food for small birds and other small animals, which themselves are the food for birds of prey…This in fact reduces the territorial resources of animals (birds of prey are at high risk being on the top ot of the ecological system) and is presently one of the main reason of difficulties for the survival of species.
One of us has recently read an article .based on a book written the philosopher O. Franceschelli “Nature after Darwin” The question is what is NATURE and which rule has the human being in this. After Darwin we cannot misuse the concept of Nature anymore. In the past (Descartes, Kant) considered the human being as apart from nature.
He in fact was allowed to use and misuse Nature and environment for his own purposes (this is also the catholic way to look at it in fact), but after Darwin this isn’t possible anymore, he has in fact clarified that we belong to nature. We are part of the nature, influences it and are ourselves influenced from nature.
Darwin has described that there isn’t good or wrong in nature itself (we do not think that S2 is bad) so there isn’t in fact an ethic in nature itself. Darwin clarifies that the lack of ethic in nature does not mean that the human being cannot distinguish good or wrong, this simply means we are responsible for the decision. From the naturalistic point of view this means we have the full responsibility of our actions for and against nature rhythm and evolution. Because we have the culture to do it and
Are conscious that our evolution has taken us to this point where we can decide and intervene on natural selection and generally speaking on moral norms.
Darwin does not give us the aim for a world without any moral against nature, but he shows that we have to engage ourselves for a responsible naturalism. This is what the author of this article calls “supportive wisdom”.
Anyway you have got on yr site the letters of some biologists and researchers what have a high experience by working directly on the field (such as Mr Nash of Canadian foundation and MR Dell’Omo of Ornis italica) and they gave you suggestions to how to manage this problem. Some of you told us you had excellent results with yr way to proceed, but you cannot consider yr country as a far island, your results are also due to the actions made in other countries (in fact Pa is german , S2 is Belgian and the orign of Ma was unknown..) peregrines have a skill to fly long distances and covers in few days many European countries when migrating . Thus you have now the responsibility also in front of the other countries which themselves are making several efforts (better of your or not) to keep the peregrines out of danger to disappear. Birds do not recognize borders they are citizens of the whole world so may do we all considering our common responsibility to cooperate in order to improve the actual situation of environment and of animals
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non e' esattamente quello che era scritto ma il mio inglese e' commerciale e mi riesce difficle fare di meglio... tagliando molto ho poi aggiunto ed intortato qualcosa... forse troppo, Taglia pure carlo se lo ritieni
We would like to remind you that all over Europe there are very few places were NATURE is really natural… From yr webcam you see an artificial nest in an artificial building and all around a wonderful view of farms.. while natural places are forest, thunder, desert, savana (if you want to see how a natural scrape for a nest looks like whatch at the website of Shenandoah Park)…Farms and their environment belong to the part of world modified by human beings properly.
Our part of Europe has a lot of industrial areas or urban areas and ground used for agricultural cultivation… just a small part of it is free .. (while in the USA and Canada they have wide natural parks, our are mainly small from the point of view of a falcon. This is why we control the number of several animal by banding them, this is why we try to protect and rescue animals wounded or in difficulty (in specialized rescue centers) there are projects for turtles, eagles, fogs and hundreds or thousands of other animals. Even if Netherlands is trying to do the best to reduce pollution and chemicals, the use of some of them (less dangerous we assume) is still allowed and necessary to farmers to avoid attacks of parasites… but parasites are often the food for small birds and other small animals, which themselves are the food for birds of prey…This in fact reduces the territorial resources of animals (birds of prey are at high risk being on the top ot of the ecological system) and is presently one of the main reason of difficulties for the survival of species.
One of us has recently read an article .based on a book written the philosopher O. Franceschelli “Nature after Darwin” The question is what is NATURE and which rule has the human being in this. After Darwin we cannot misuse the concept of Nature anymore. In the past (Descartes, Kant) considered the human being as apart from nature.
He in fact was allowed to use and misuse Nature and environment for his own purposes (this is also the catholic way to look at it in fact), but after Darwin this isn’t possible anymore, he has in fact clarified that we belong to nature. We are part of the nature, influences it and are ourselves influenced from nature.
Darwin has described that there isn’t good or wrong in nature itself (we do not think that S2 is bad) so there isn’t in fact an ethic in nature itself. Darwin clarifies that the lack of ethic in nature does not mean that the human being cannot distinguish good or wrong, this simply means we are responsible for the decision. From the naturalistic point of view this means we have the full responsibility of our actions for and against nature rhythm and evolution. Because we have the culture to do it and
Are conscious that our evolution has taken us to this point where we can decide and intervene on natural selection and generally speaking on moral norms.
Darwin does not give us the aim for a world without any moral against nature, but he shows that we have to engage ourselves for a responsible naturalism. This is what the author of this article calls “supportive wisdom”.
Anyway you have got on yr site the letters of some biologists and researchers what have a high experience by working directly on the field (such as Mr Nash of Canadian foundation and MR Dell’Omo of Ornis italica) and they gave you suggestions to how to manage this problem. Some of you told us you had excellent results with yr way to proceed, but you cannot consider yr country as a far island, your results are also due to the actions made in other countries (in fact Pa is german , S2 is Belgian and the orign of Ma was unknown..) peregrines have a skill to fly long distances and covers in few days many European countries when migrating . Thus you have now the responsibility also in front of the other countries which themselves are making several efforts (better of your or not) to keep the peregrines out of danger to disappear. Birds do not recognize borders they are citizens of the whole world so may do we all considering our common responsibility to cooperate in order to improve the actual situation of environment and of animals
========================================
non e' esattamente quello che era scritto ma il mio inglese e' commerciale e mi riesce difficle fare di meglio... tagliando molto ho poi aggiunto ed intortato qualcosa... forse troppo, Taglia pure carlo se lo ritieni
"Il gatto disse: non sono un amico e non sono un servitore. Sono il gatto che cammina da solo e desidero entrare nella tua tana." Rudyard Kipling